Shuffling units after you've already finished moving them

[fatolaf]

so you can keep the vitriol to yourself.

Where's the fun in that.

[The Trampoline]

I leave a unit alone once I've moved on, even if I suddenly realise it would be better in another position.

I think its worth looking at the whole and deciding how all your units will move rather than what I used to do and react with each unit by itself. Even moving a unit back and forth during its movement is ad as it can get out of position. I try not to do that but sometimes I fail...

[anavorn]

Don't mind a minor shuffle to change the angle of a unit and usually would let a complete takeback of a move - rarely a problem but sometimes units seem to gain an extra inch or two as they can never go back to the exact start point.

Am a bit more strict on the 1" rule, e.g. at deployment if 1" spacing would mean unit might start in terrain or it can't fit in it's current formation but that'd depend on the type of game it was.

[Toast]

I think if Unit B fails a march block test, leaving unit A somewhere it would rather not be, then that's tough and you shouldn't be allowed to move unit A back 4" so you still have a battle line.  That's cheating!

Otherwise, if it's just a bit of adjustment at the end of the phase, that's fine.  However depending on circumstance it might be unfair, esp with fast cav, flyers etc who have already move maximum distance.  If you haven't got the distance to get your redirectors into the perfect spot, hard cheese.

Can't you tell I'm a tournament veteran   

[jackhoneysett]

(looking at you Jack  )

I saw this post title and thought I might get a mention sooner or later! 

The 'Shuffle Phase' no longer exists in 8th ed, which is very sad! I admit in 7th I used to go back and readjust the angles of units to best fit whatever evil plan I had for that turn - but I would like to point out that I only ever shuffled units backwards, rather than trying to gain extra distance.

I've just about managed to wean myself out of the Shuffle now, so once I've moved a unit I don't go back and move it again. I agree it rarely makes a difference, but that's how the rules say to do it. I normally wouldn't mind people who ask to do a bit of minor shuffling at the end, as long as it's clear they're not being dodgy. But it's not strictly allowed.

[fatolaf]

Am a bit more strict on the 1" rule, e.g. at deployment if 1" spacing would mean unit might start in terrain or it can't fit in it's current formation but that'd depend on the type of game it was.

Agree on deployment but once the game starts, I find it churlish to start pointing it out to people, that's if I even spot it, simple way to avoid it is to have movment trays with a bit of scenery like my TK, it's then virtually impossible to be within an inch anyway...

[Meals]

So the outcome, is it is a really grey area and depends how you feel on the day and whats being shuffled.

How about going with "if you've rolled dice, you/I can't fiddle with stuff that's previously been moved"?

[Dave]

I apply the universal special rule 'don't be a dick about it'.  As long as players adhere to that there are seldom any problems.

[roland murat]

command and control is a vital part of warfare and, much like toast, I don't believe people should have two attempts at organising a battle line. If one of the unit commanders is an idiot and something goes wrong thats tough.

This isn't to say I'm against a little shuffling,  I just don't like the idea of being able to go back to rectify a problem caused by the dice. If its that important do the random movement first.

[Angelus Mortifer]

Makes more of a difference in 40k from what I can understand with the comparisons... or rather, maybe 40k is designed such that it is a more conscious aberration to move a unit and then attempt to go back and adjust, particularly because of the difference in units used.

Fantasy is all about blocks of infantry and huge beasties, all played on large trays and bases for ease of movement and time. I'm assuming that once a unit of halberdiers advances (as a block), you at least know where the limit of that movement now is (for the whole unit) should your opponent attempt a minor shuffle. I'm assuming the same goes for unit alignment to get a charge off or whatever.

40k is a full on skirmish game where units operate in a fluid and open formation. As the footprint of a unit can markedly change at many points during the game, it's harder to keep an eye on where individual models can be, and especially when within each unit you're actually dealing with c. 10 individual models who can all go 6" in any direction.

I prefer to try and keep as close to ensuring models move up to their allocated distance, and never going back to a unit that has already completed it's move for the phase. Personally, it's helped me be a better player, ensuring I get things right at the first attempt (or not, and getting sucker-punched), but it's also made me a good judge of distance too.

For 40k, where close combat is exceptionally bloody most of the time, and often quite a short affair too, I get a bit frustrated with some opponents I've played in major tourneys who have for example:

- literally piled models into assault because they have so many, and on the assumption that by being "clumsily assumptive and quick" they're actually doing us both a favour to ensure no slow play/time issues.

- piled in to assault keeping pretty close to the 6" move for all, but then changing their mind in terms of the order of the pile-ins and at the second attempt their models suddenly acquire 8-10" of pile-in move.

- Some how piling in with a model all the way around the back of my unit, even though it would take two turns of normal movement to actually achieve that.

My point here is that in 40k, distance and positioning really matter, as it can often be the difference of a successful assault and rout, to then be in a much better position for your next engagement than you would otherwise have been.

This issue really is dependent on the setting. A pick-up game on a Mon night with a good mate doesn't need to be strict unless you both fancy a game that strongly adheres to the rules. Final game in a tourney where a win could put you in the top 10 - many would adopt a more stricter approach than they normally do, because there's something at stake.

It doesn't hurt to clarify how you prefer to play and "be played" by your oppo beforehand. I always try to be flexible in most of my games, because at the end of the day it's about having fun. If I meet a total fcukwit in round 3 of a tourney who is clearly abusing someone's generosity, I'll tell him. If it continues then he gets the bag of dice to the face and I get a max score ;)