7th Ed 40k Comp WIP

[lagar312]

Planet OG Comp

•   No unbound armies - Armies must be battle-forged and have a max of 2 detachments (this includes the primary detachment).
•   Come the Apocalypse Allies are not allowed
•   No Lords of War may be taken
•   Fortifications are allowed (except for the Fortress of Redemption and Aquila Stronghold).
•   Psychic phase - The warp charge pool is capped at 12 dice
•   Flyers are 0-2 choice (Only one can be AV12)
•   Flying MC's are 0-2 choice
•   Any combo of the above is capped at 0-2
•   max 2 of Elite/FA/Heavy with no duplicates

[roland murat]

No double vindi? Sad panda

[fatolaf]

The max 2 FA/Elite/Heavy rule seems very strong, with the no spam rule, why has the new edition made that bit of comp necessary?

[underscore]

It might be an idea to wait a bit on the warp charge-cap as well: 12 might make sense for fantasy but, if I remember correctly, it's slightly harder to pull spells off with the new 40k system. If you're comping spam then that should avoid most of the more excessive charge-banking anyway.

I can imagine that a cap will be needed at some point (a Tzeentch Daemon list can, admittedly, generate a silly amount and remain legal for this comp), but it might be worth holding off for more playtesting on what it should be. It might even be worth considering a casting cap rather than a generation cap, for example.

[roland murat]

The max 2 FA/Elite/Heavy rule seems very strong, with the no spam rule, why has the new edition made that bit of comp necessary?

Got my copy of the rules today and only just started to read through. Having said that, I'm not sure unless its to stop elder walker spam etc

[fatolaf]

Got my copy of the rules today and only just started to read through. Having said that, I'm not sure unless its to stop elder walker spam etc

The no duplication rule stops any spam (outside of troops) but this rule really hurts a lot of armies, DoC for instance rely on FA for all their best units, letting them only have 2 non spammed units is harsh beyond extreme..
We did not have that rule in 6th Ed OG comp, not sure why it's needed in 7th

[fatolaf]

Planet OG Comp

•   No unbound armies - Armies must be battle-forged and have a max of 2 detachments (this includes the primary detachment).
•   Come the Apocalypse Allies are not allowed
•   No Lords of War may be taken
•   Fortifications are allowed (except for the Fortress of Redemption and Aquila Stronghold)
•   Flyers are 0-2 choice (Only one can be AV12)
•   Flying MC's are 0-2 choice
•   Any combo of the above is capped at 0-2

That to me is all you need for now, it's a new rule set. And if you want to attract players from outside the club, this is prob the max amount of comp you will get away with.....

[Deathwing_Matt]

The no duplication rule stops any spam (outside of troops) but this rule really hurts a lot of armies, DoC for instance rely on FA for all their best units, letting them only have 2 non spammed units is harsh beyond extreme..
We did not have that rule in 6th Ed OG comp, not sure why it's needed in 7th

I agree with Ol that  the rule of max 2 of Elite/FA/Heavy with no duplicates is far too heavy and throws the baby out with the bathwater. It'll penalise some of the weaker codices much more than the stronger ones. For example, Nids are quite dependent on heavy support, as are CSM with fast attack. It would also make some builds, like Ravenwing almost impossible to do.

I'd suggest that the normal force org is fine, with no more than 2 of a given unit outside of troops as we had before.

[Deathwing_Matt]

That to me is all you need for now, it's a new rule set. And if you want to attract players from outside the club, this is prob the max amount of comp you will get away with.....

Likewise - we can always review once people have played some more games - the new edition has only been out a week!

[lagar312]

Happy to drop the dice cap and unit restrictions gent.
It was lifted from the last OG Comp but tbh i'd be happy to test this out with minimal comp and see what stands out as needing moderation!

[fatolaf]

I'd suggest that the normal force org is fine, with no more than 2 of a given unit outside of troops as we had before.

The old OG rules was no duplication at all outside of troops, this seemed to work well

[Deathwing_Matt]

The old OG rules was no duplication at all outside of troops, this seemed to work well

Wasn't that the most recent comp? Earlier versions had the two max and I don't think that's a problem at all

[fatolaf]

Wasn't that the most recent comp? Earlier versions had the two max and I don't think that's a problem at all

It was the comp we used for about a year, letting 2 of the same of to me was a problem , you might as well let 3...

But I don't play the game any more, so it's up to you guys...

Just with new Damage rules, I never did but even more so now, I would not want to face double Vindi...

[jansuza]

Whoa no duplicates really screws some armies over. I would say stick to no triplicates rather.

Don't know how the magic phase will really work in practice, but as far as I can see, it doesn't look massively overpowered. We can always monitor it as we go along.

Are there any particular Lords of War anybody is worried about? I've always thought LoW really suck at games under 2000 points.

[lagar312]

Whoa no duplicates really screws some armies over. I would say stick to no triplicates rather.

Don't know how the magic phase will really work in practice, but as far as I can see, it doesn't look massively overpowered. We can always monitor it as we go along.

Are there any particular Lords of War anybody is worried about? I've always thought LoW really suck at games under 2000 points.

Yeah I think we'll stick with the paired back comp atm... I want to see how the Magic phase goes for a few games and see what the general consensus is!

On the LoW front having just flicked through the Imperial Knights codex I'm not so sure LoW are that bad but I think a cap as suggested by Seb is a good idea... No aficionado but want to stop someone turning up with a Warlord Titan or something equally silly...

[roland murat]

What books are the Lords of War in? Is it just i-books?

[jansuza]

All of their rules are in the escalation book. It's quite a nice book actually!

Well I think we're all pretty close to the same page, just that were all undecided about magic, so how about we get out there and have some games, and then talk again?

[fatolaf]

Magic wise, all the rage and proposed comp seems to revolve around Invisibilty

[lagar312]

Magic wise, all the rage and proposed comp seems to revolve around Invisibilty

Plus deamonic summoning i believe

[Steve H]

Plus deamonic summoning i believe

I really like all the summoning spells... Let's not complete all of the fun out of club games please!

I've been looking at tournament lists and they are sooooooo boring... But I honestly think we don't have those players here so we may be overreacting!

[katarr]

I agree with Steve, comp should be fairly loose - stopping just the maddest of shit. If two players agree to something else beforehand that is fine of course but with only a few members having played a few games I think it would be wise to be cautious with the comp hammer before actual experience tells us otherwise.

[Angelus Mortifer]

For reference, Imperial Knights are not Lords of War funnily enough, as they have their own Codex and loose FOC if you wanted to run an army of nothing but. Otherwise, they are a secondary detachment consisting of 1-3 Knights.

Most Lords of War are currently in the Escalation Book (that giant Khorne Tractor, SM Thunderhawk, Imperial Baneblade, Necron floating ghetto blaster etc), and future books will have additions.

Agree that comp should be loose to start and then managed once we have the benefit of several games worth of experience. The Psychic phase is actually pretty balanced, the only pain being cheap WC Invisibility as Ol mentions.

[JackM]

hey guys whats the comp as it stands? speaking with different guys last thursday a few were saying no triplicates outside of troops and others were saying no duplicates.

Just my two bits, IMO 12 magic phase dice is more than enough for a fun game anymore than that and one person just owns the magic phase and can shut down the other players spells. I think you should allow some lords of war but nothing that can ignore cover (D weapons/Hellstorm), have anything above a 5" blast or fly. I honestly think no triplicates is better than duplicates because personally (nids) need survivable synapse and that comes from elites and HQ, if I can only get one then that's gonna suck.

[fatolaf]

The Old comp was no triples outside of troops, but as the new edition is so new, I dont think any comp has been decided on yet..

If in doubt revert to the old OG Comp for every game, 'dont be a d**k comp'