Battle for Planet OG - Part II - Sat September 10th

[Meals]

Special Well done to James and Ian with their good finishes with somewhat weaker codecs....

Anything is possible when you can drop 5 wound allocating Bloodcrushers in your opponents face!  after that there's not really much thought to it

Oh, what could have been if I hadn't drawn Robs Dark Eldar, basically the worst matchup ever for Daemons (ignoring Grey Knights, because you may as well not bother playing that game...), and then had crap luck for my reserves to boot... 

Anyway thanks Ol, and thanks to my opponents for enjoyable games, particularly Chris and Tom, for not throwing stuff at me as my Bloodcrushers rolled over them without stopping 

Missionwise:

As I said yesterday, I think you need to keep KPs for one primary, to at least make vehicle spam/MSU a less viable option. Possibly make transports worth 3 KPs each as well. Call the mission "Disruption Strike" or something along the lines of slowing down the opposing army.

The crazy explosion mission didn't turn out so crazy in the end, the average rolls for the eruptions meant they pretty much just passed over everything and hit near the edge of the board. That combined with the secondary forcing everyone to the middle, kind of meant the explosions were just an annoying additional roll every turn. I guess this was partially your plan, to force a big brawl in the middle, but that just helped me out big time, because I didn't have to chase anything around.

I'd suggest that if you really want the eruptions to create mayhem, you either need to go for 4d6 scatter or boost it up to 12d6 and let the eruptions bounce back along their path.

The second mission was way too tough for the attacker, as firstly with Dawn of War, you had way too far to go to even get to the objectives, and secondly, since the defender could just assault you to stop it, it was simply a matter of throwing away a cheap unit each turn to make it impossible. I'm not really sure that just forcing the objectives to be along the middle line would help in anyway, as its still seems pretty tough to destroy an objective if the Defenders not an idiot.

[fatolaf]

The second mission was way too tough for the attacker, as firstly with Dawn of War, you had way too far to go to even get to the objectives, and secondly, since the defender could just assault you to stop it, it was simply a matter of throwing away a cheap unit each turn to make it impossible. I'm not really sure that just forcing the objectives to be along the middle line would help in anyway, as its still seems pretty tough to destroy an objective if the Defenders not an idiot.

Agreed, but again with a few adjustments, I think we can get this one to work...

Going now to work on a MSU killer mission

[Meals]

I suggest one mission that deters MSU and one that deters infantry spam (if only from a game time perspective). It's never fun to have to cut a game short because of time running out. My grats to Toby though for getting through his games (that I'm aware of, anyway...)

[fatolaf]

I suggest one mission that deters MSU and one that deters infantry spam

I have come up with both, the 2nd one is insane, and put it this way, this time something is going to get hit... .

[rathstar]

s

Oh, what could have been if I hadn't drawn Robs Dark Eldar, basically the worst matchup ever for Daemons (ignoring Grey Knights, because you may as well not bother playing that game...), and then had crap luck for my reserves to boot... 
...
Anyway thanks Ol, and thanks to my opponents for enjoyable games, particularly Chris and Tom, for not throwing stuff at me as my Bloodcrushers rolled over them without stopping 

Missionwise:

As I said yesterday, I think you need to keep KPs for one primary, to at least make vehicle spam/MSU a less viable option. Possibly make transports worth 3 KPs each as well. Call the mission "Disruption Strike" or something along the lines of slowing down the opposing army.

I have to agree you did have poor reserve rolls for the entire game, while my shooting was only a  bit poor for the first turn, not helped by your horrors passing 14 of their 16 saves after being hit by 4 missiles, boy were they a pain during the game :)  However there are much worse match ups.  38 of my 44 infantry models were assault troops (that had 18 pistols and 2 flamers between them all as their only shooting), imagine a shooty army that used some vehicles.At least the majority of my army wanted to be in combat.


I still don't get the vehicle hatred.  I've never seen a battle report in white dwarf that didn't have a few vehicles each side.  After all did you expect 10 point, toughness 3, 6+ armour save, assault troops to walk across the board :)

I look forward to the next set of missions, they added a nice new element to the day.  Just be careful what changing the rulebook balance of one (normal) kill point game to 2 objective games will encouage further.  With 2 misions giving penalties to vehicle armies it no wonder that two armies didn't have a single vehicle.  All infantry armies that sit and shoot each other will be accompanied by deathwing and paladin grey knight armies.  Hopefully this won't happen because there was a nice mix of armies at the tournament.

Rathstar

[badusernametag]

I still don't get the vehicle hatred

Dude you can't deny that you're army is a maths hammer tournament army? You're a good guy and fun to play but these arguments are weak in the face of what you brought to a 'fluff friendly' event. Tipping the odds in your favour is easy in a completely unbalanced game. If you want to argue for balance and fairness play chess, or risk even. All GW games are rotten to the core, mainly as its a publicly traded company and they need to continue to sell products. The point of comp is to make the thing more even handed and fair, make you think in different, tactical ways or just be plain fun and varied. I'd like to see events like this FORCE me to play a certain army, play style or adopt a silly, slightly homophobic accent. For something called fun. If I want to win I'll go kickboxing, or seal clubbing. Man barbies is just that, well in this (OG) context anyway. In fact there's loads of 'serious' events where sweaty men with little sex life argue over an inch. Just saying. Savvy?

/end rant

Also Ol, have a couple of ideas. Will PM you when I've sensible, non-ranty time.

Toby (Still shouting, through the interwebs, into your bones)

ps. Yeah James it was a slog and effort to get through the games, but if you're gonna play a list like that you have to except the pain. I thought it'd be a laugh. Also, let's not beat on those Orks and Nids now heh? And also, arn't DOC infantry spam by default..?

[maelzch]

If I want to win I'll go kickboxing, or seal clubbing.

This has to be the quote of the week!

[badusernametag]

Oh and thanks for ANOTHER excellent day Ol. Do keep it up, becoming a regular treat, not to mention the only time I actually play, HAH!

and Seb, best game of the day. Keep it up. Next time There will be Blood!

T

[rathstar]

Tipping the odds in your favour is easy in a completely unbalanced game.

, such as making any anti tank weapons your opponent has brought ineffecient by bringing all infantry.

No one warned me, and there was nothing on the forum to say this was a fluff bunny event.  I saw the missions didn't favour tanks or high kill point armies, but took my army anyway.  Fully expecting to lose the kill point mission, which I did.  And while everyone was pleasent, some nice fluffy armies were around, and it was a nice relaxed tournment, I saw nothing fluffy about the top 4 armies (mine included), they were nothing I wouldn't expect to see at any tournament.

If vehicles are so wrong I'll bring something else next time.  It's been a while since I've used whirlwinds & flamers, it'll be nice to use them in an environment where they're more useful.

Ol:  I know it takes alot of effort to set-up and run these things, and even more to come up with interesting new scenarios, so a big thanks from me, and keep up the good work.

Rathstar

[Angelus Mortifer]

(...wading in dangerously here :) )

I think gamers need to appreciate what a "fluffy" army is, and it's general definition. Fluff doesn't automatically mean average or all-comers in terms of lists. A fluffy army build mimics the codex background for how that race wages war essentially. Furthermore, most codices have more than one option for building an army that fits the background.

For example, Orks by their fluff have either a green tide of infantry, a force of ramshackle vehicles belching smoke, or a combination of the two as their most obvious list options that fits the fluff. However, facing an entire tables-worth of Ork infantry at 1500-1750pts is, whilst VERY fluffy, exceptionally annoying to most, and difficult to shift under the current rules structure.

Fluff-wise, Blood Angels are predominantly Fast armour and/or a heavy Jump Pack presence. Nids are  mainly a tide of claws with islands of MCs. IG probably have the most "up front" fluff builds because of the book's diversity: mass infantry, mass tanks, multiple flying transports and their combinations. To be fair, Codex Marines are probably my first choice for a fluffy army that is all-comers too: quintessential Codex Astartes combined arms force (like the Ultramarines I faced in round 2 :) - awesome game, and excellent paint job mate ).

Point being, if you're looking to create a "friendly" tournament setting (and everything that possibly entails) you need to think of lists in terms of all comers rather than fluff. That ensures list diversity, the reduction of spam, and probably encourages a lot more to play out of their comfort zone too.

Of my games, I thought Toby's mass IG was actually very fluffy, but like the Ork example it was still a very strong list for how difficult it is to breakdown (without some impressive luck or a tailor-made list of your own) - my most difficult game of the 3, but still fun.

Chris' Ultras were, for me the most fluffy and the most balanced in terms of composition, and as a consequence we had a really enjoyable game....

...then there were the Necrons. A book so out of date, with next to no options or variations, that one can only describe it as fluffy and "balanced". I still felt like I cheated by just turning up to play, as the game ended Turn 3... :( Ian was a great opponent nevertheless, as he obviously knew what to expect bringing what he did, and should be applauded for still giving it a go.

My 2p's worth...